Why did God harden the pharaohs heart if free will is supposed to be an important concept?

Why did God harden the pharaohs heart if free will is supposed to be an important concept?

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  1. 5 months ago
    JWanon

    Why did God harden Pharaoh's heart?
    Some translations of the bible make it seem that God caused Pharaoh’s heart to harden; therefore he had no choice but to refuse to let Israel go. If that were true then God would be guilty of taking away Pharaoh’s free will or his freedom of choice. That is something God would never do to anyone. Here’s how a more modern translation renders one of those verses:

    “As for me, I will allow Pharaoh’s heart to become obstinate, and I will multiply my signs and my miracles in the land of Egypt.” Exodus 7:3 NWT

    You can tell that this is a rendering that is closer to the original meaning by examining other verses from different bible translations. This verse is from the American Standard Version:

    “Wherefore then do ye harden your hearts, as the Egyptians and Pharaoh hardened their hearts? When he had wrought wonderfully among them, did they not let the people go, and they departed?” 1 Samuel 6:6

    That verse indicates that Pharaoh was responsible for his own heart condition. That same bible version says “God hardened his heart.” at Exodus 7:3 Here’s yet another verse from a different translation that is worthy of consideration:

    “And the scholars said to the Pharaoh “It is the finger of God”; but the Pharaoh was headstrong and would not listen to them, as Jehovah had predicted.” Exodus 8:18 Byington Translation

    It is clear that God did not cause Pharaoh's heart to harden; but he did allow it and he fortold that would be the case.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >but he did allow it
      That still means the Pharaoh didn't have free will. If it takes God to allow you to do something then you didn't have free will in the first place.

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        lol the line explicitly states that it was in gods power to strip him of his free will and make the choice for him, but god explicitly did not do that, because the pharoah acting according to his own free will was important

        • 5 months ago
          Anonymous

          Allowing someone to do something assumes that it wasn't allowed before you allowed them

          God is omnipresent, he's aware of literally everything that will ever happen. He just chose not to change it. That's free will.

          Allowing something is a change

      • 5 months ago
        Alectorios

        I’d like to offer an interpretation from a different perspective that might help make sense of the book of Exodus, which as you may now know is an unbalanced book. If you don’t know, the first part of the book is the story of Moses taking the people of Israel out of Egypt by the grace of God. The last part is about how to properly construct the tabernacle…

        In the scene with the burning bush God says to Moses, “I am that I am.” St. Thomas Aquinis, the patron saint of higher learning, said that this can be taken to mean that God is existence itself. Existence with all of its natural laws, causes and effects. Existence with its history and its future. Existence within the present that we all call home.

        In that case, God, or the infinite factors that play a role in what existence is, hardened pharaohs heart. Thus He did so while also not betraying free will.

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        God is omnipresent, he's aware of literally everything that will ever happen. He just chose not to change it. That's free will.

  2. 5 months ago
    John Calvin

    Free Will? Never heard of him.

  3. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    God is an butthole. Nothing else even makes a slight bit of sense. He exists but he is not nice. He’s like a toddler squishing ants.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      He owns the ant farm stupid

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        I would say abusing animals you own is still immoral but perhaps Abrahamoids disagree

        • 5 months ago
          Anonymous

          abuse implies the actions are unjust

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            As opposed to the just cases of torturing your subjects

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            Yes

            No, it implies they aren't edifying. For instance you can abuse alcohol. Are you saying God can grow as a person?

            That's substance abuse, OP in

            I would say abusing animals you own is still immoral but perhaps Abrahamoids disagree

            is referring to abuse of others

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            No, it implies they aren't edifying. For instance you can abuse alcohol. Are you saying God can grow as a person?

  4. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    Old Testicle God explicitly only considers israelites real humans

  5. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    The Egyptians oppressed his people for 400 years just because they were envious and intimidated by them, despite being saved from famine Joseph's interpretation of God's dream. God allowed it to happen because he wanted to humble them down before he made them a great nation. So that they knew what it's like to be at the bottom, so that they would not oppress the poor once they were at the top. A lot of God's laws are about being kind and generous to the poor and not oppressing them but doing them justice instead. And helping everyone who is in need. God puts a LOT of emphasis in helping the poor and the needy as an obligation.

    But once they were humbled down he wanted to stomp on the buttholes who oppressed them for 400 years. And so he did.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >The Egyptians oppressed his people for 400 years
      Maybe the creator of the universe and prime mover could have done something about that. I guess the Egyptians had iron chariots though.

      >he wanted to humble them down before he made them a great nation.

      they got genocided by romans so it wasn't that great.

      Killing all the first born of egypt was a dick move tbh. It sounds like pure incel fanfiction.

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        Read before writing.
        They God genocided after they forgot about God and served other gods for hundreds of years and persecuted and kileld every prophet sent to warn them.

        In Deuteronomy there is a very stern warning about all the horrors that God would do to them if they betrayed him. God gave them so many blessings and gifts and saved them from so many enemies much more powerful than them for them to forget about him. God's patient lasted centuries.

  6. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    To preserve the pharaoh's free will. The plagues of Egypt that took place were obviously supernatural, thus they could affect the pharaoh's free will.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >I'm preserving your free will by taking away your free will

  7. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    The blind don't believe in God.
    "i'M iN tOtAl CoNtRoL..."
    Their funeral.

  8. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    He didn't
    Pharaoh chose to harden his heart first, God just took that choice to the utter most
    based God

  9. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    Free will theodicy is not biblical and the most making the argument do not actually believe it. They just need something to say

  10. 5 months ago
    Alectorios

    I’d like to offer an interpretation from a different perspective that might help make sense of the book of Exodus, which as you may now know is an unbalanced book. If you don’t know, the first part of the book is the story of Moses taking the people of Israel out of Egypt by the grace of God. The last part is about how to properly construct the tabernacle…

    In the scene with the burning bush God says to Moses, “I am that I am.” St. Thomas Aquinis, the patron saint of higher learning, said that this can be taken to mean that God is existence itself. Existence with all of its natural laws, causes and effects. Existence with its history and its future. Existence within the present that we all call home.

    In that case, God, or the infinite factors that play a role in what existence is, hardened pharaohs heart. Thus He did so while also not betraying free will.

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