If I were an ancient human and saw lightning and rainbows, I would invent God, too
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 Nothing Ever Happens Shirt $21.68 |
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If I were an ancient human and saw lightning and rainbows, I would invent God, too
Talk religion
Talk religion
If I were an ancient human and saw lightning and rainbows, I would invent God, too
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Nothing Ever Happens Shirt $21.68 |
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Yeah for sure. I get why they were religious back then. Now not so much.
>Now not so much.
How do you justify the rules of logic, sense of self. consciousness, orderliness of the universe and the past, the future, ought is problem? (materialism cant)
>If I were an ancient human and saw lightning and rainbows, I would invent God, too
are you claiming that lightning and rainbows invented god then?
no, I’m just saying lightning and rainbows would be a pretty strong catalyst for those ideas. The smartest and wisest men would have had absolutely no idea how they happened. When people asked them, they probably didn’t want to say “I dunno” so they came up with God. And the people were like “woah, tell us more about these gods” so the guy said “yeah so you need to stop being a shithead and give us priests 10% of your income.” Obviously the details aren’t perfect but you get the idea
damn, just like today with scientists
and we're no closer to answering life's big questions. really big think
yeah just imagine if we didn’t have social media for people to spread criticisms of modern science. Everyone would be triple vaxxed and wearing their maskies.
>and we're no closer to answering life's big questions
What?
like, what is your fate? where do u go when u die? what is the right thing to do, what is good and evil? what is consciousness and what is a human being really? what are we really doing... and if the answer is "nothing" why does the question exist?
When you die you die, good and evil are moral judgments and morality is a social instinct to keep and maintain social behavior which has a downstream interpretation by culture. Sometimes individuals can spread ideas that things people were doing fit into their conception of wrong or right
that's just as reductive as goddunnit
All that matters is if it aligns with the facts
but something that vague can align with many different scenarios to the point of being just as useless as goddunnit
It evolved, all social mammals have some degree of moral behavior where they treat the group as themselves/ a part of the same unit. Oxytocin is one component of the mechanism, activating pro-social behavioral circuits
which part of the Talmud is this from?
I see a white flag
nah. you can only list abstract, unsatisfying descriptions of phenomena. It's actually a step back from goddunnit
Scientists don’t get paid shit, moron
They're the intellectual equivalent of a priesthood. Obviously our society is atheist and that includes not believing in science for most
God does cause lightning though. The form of lightning is in the mind of God and apprehended by mortals as lightning.
>no, I’m just saying lightning and rainbows would be a pretty strong catalyst for those ideas
then those ideas must be god then, right?
they would have invented religion regardless. There are plenty of mysterious phenomena in the world, like rain, fire, dreams, death, the existence of life and all the various species of life, earthquakes, hurricanes, eclipses, the stars, sneezing, etc.
i dont really understand what you mean, it would be easier for me if you answered my question
NTA
Thunders and earthquakes, drought and whatever are a proof that God exists, because only a mighty being can make them.
They are not God, but usually made from them and mainly God's can wield them.
>did lightning invent God?
your question is moronic. Anyone with an IQ above 95 can understand what I’m saying
>Anyone with an IQ above 95 can understand what I’m saying
then you'd have to be able to tell me, right?
…he said you should already understand, and he’s right. And if you can’t then debating with you would be a waste of time.
either answer my question or admit that you can't, this is just a waste of time.
You wasted everyone’s time the second you said you thought it was lightning that created gods from reading the op.
It’s like those rides where you can’t get on if you’re below a certain height.
>it was lightning that created gods from reading the op
no, according to op, it was the idea caused by lightning, but this would lead one to believe that the idea is god
Op is saying if you lived back before modern knowledge, seeing lightning would make you think a super powerful god-like being created it.
Ideas are ideas, not gods. If you’re saying god is a type of idea then I agree, but ideas are also just in peoples heads
>seeing lightning would make you think a super powerful god-like being created it
i see, this would mean god is not inherent to the lightning wouldnt it? so is god defined by it?
It would mean they thought gods created the lighting. Feel like this shouldn’t need to be explained
>gods created the lighting
so god is independent of lightning, contrary to what op mentioned?
you were genetically predetermined to be a Christian, you are so moronic
are you conceding ops statement? if not, it would be required for you to demonstrate the contrary
it's a fun example because lightning is very hard to study due to its speed and randomness
Well, they didn't. By the mid 20th century most scholars agree that religion and gods were not in fact induced to explain natural phenomena. A lightning is a good example:
>>>>Wtf was that?
>>>Zeus was angry
>>Ok so... wtf was that?
>Idk actually
It’s a spark of static electricity moving between ionized (charged) areas, hope this helps.
Thanks! How would that help?
doesn’t change the fact that their understanding of the world was mostly “god did it” and that’s why they invented god in the first place. Even without god, humans invent all sorts of wacky theories to explain something they don’t understand. That happens even in science
>their understanding of the world was mostly “god did it”
Which is no understanding at all so it obviously wasn't the reason.
It's like me saying "they invented gods to have bowling buddies, yeah I know inventing gods doesn't actually produce bowling buddies, but that's why they did it"...
>Which is no understanding at all so it obviously wasn't the reason.
It’s called being wrong
They weren't wrong in their explanations. They literally had no explanation. Again, see the bowling buddy example.
>the explanation is it's beyond explanation
>btw gods
Not quite there, Anon. Care to try again?
>refer me
Georges Lemaître. The Big Bang theory was precisely an investigation into how God created the universe, since there was no actual explanation.
The Big Bang says nothing about how matter came into existence in the first place. We’re able to study background radiation but at the moment we can’t explain why the Big Bang happened in the first place. And that’s where theists say “it’s magic, god did it, scientists will never understand it”
You asked me for a theist who felt the need to investigate. Georges did. I didn't claim he figured it out to the very end. But his research aimed to answer precisely the process of creation.
Not sure where he cited magic.
I specifically wrote
>how did he create it from nothing
The Big Bang doesn’t answer that. No theist is concerned with how god creates matter from nothing. It’s just beyond our understanding, and that’s that. You know this is true. This is exactly how ancient humans understood lightning, at least the majority of them
I know it doesn't answer that. Again I didn't claim he figured it out to the very end. But his research was aimed to investigate it. And that was your goalpost.
> And that was your goalpost.
It literally wasn’t and I already re-iterated that I specifically wrote “how did he create it from nothing” which is the question of today. Theists make fun of atheists for thinking the universe just popped into existence but the theist explanation is that it popped into existence because god wanted it to. Which is no more of an explanation than “lightning exists because god angry” or “rainbows exist because god sad.” Ancient humans were content with this understanding in the same way that modern theists are content with “god just created the universe from nothing.”
refer me to a single theist who has said
>>>how DID he create it from nothing??! We must investigate it!
This was met.
>Ancient humans were content with this understanding
They very well might have been. It's still not an explanation.
> It's still not an explanation.
yeah that’s the fricking point, moron. They didn’t have access to the explanation so they just said “god did it.” Humans don’t like having gaps in their knowledge, it’s really annoying. Even today, theists and “spiritual” people explain consciousness by referring to the existence of a soul or spirit etc. which really explains nothing, but in their minds this is better than nothing, so they at least feel as though they’re better than the atheists.
If you actually disagree with the premise that lightning motivated humans to invent the concept of God, which is the main topic of this thread, then you are delusional
I don't know how to explain it to you but something NOT producing an explanation kinda undermines the idea that it was consistently done to provide an explanation.
"This is probably a machine for making cows. It never produced one and never will, but I decided that's what it is."
If they wanted an explanation, they could have invented just that. And they very commonly did. Very commonly. Gods were a separate issue.
the understanding is “it’s magic from a god that’s beyond our understanding, now let’s worship him so he won’t be angry with us”
Your cope is hilarious
Please refer me to a single theist who has said
>god created the universe
>but we still don’t know how!!
>how DID he create it from nothing??! We must investigate it!
no, they all just say “god did it”
I find it interesting humans imagine a guy causing the lightning instead of just seeing the lightning as a living thing
*white people
to the noble red man, everything is alive
Humans have a personification instinct. They anthropomorphize things. It’s completely unchecked in children and they give everything a human personality