I want to believe in God but I have issues with the whole "God's plan" thing
>why would an all knowing god create beings that he knows will sin and then send them to hell for eternity when the god knows this person will fail
>why would an all knowing being change his plan for your prayer or ritual, when the god already knew of your plan and the prayer
Is there any faiths that can move past this or am I forever an unbeliever
thanks
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>then send them to hell for eternity when the god knows this person will fail
He doesn't send them to hell. They have a choice between God and The Earth. The Earth leads to death while God leads to life. If you believe Jesus was just some guy who died and there's no hope, you will die as there is no hope. If you believe in the Resurrection and that death can be conquered, you will live.
>why would an all knowing being change his plan for your prayer or ritual, when the god already knew of your plan and the prayer
He doesn't change his plan. Prayer is a conversation with God.
God doesn't exist
Can’t verify if you do either
Sure, maybe I'm a chatbot or something. But it's about the balance of probabilities isn't it? That's how human belief works. When you buy food, you can't be 100% certain that it doesn't contain poison. Instead you think "it probably doesn't contain poison" and you eat it.
determinism is that their choice is already known of, even if you are not an all knowing god then you would know the factors of their life and psychology and make a decent guess on their choice. if you created a being and knew what they were going to do because you designed them that way why send that being to suffer for eternity?
I'm trying to understand under what faiths a god could exist because so far the Christian theology doesn't make sense to me with my determinist world view. I would like to think god does exist.
Why create a being to suffer just as a demonstration, if you were a perfect planner and a perfect being surely you could create a plan without that.
Thanks for your input.
I'm 18 but I always have thought determinism to be the right way forward ever since it occurred to me when I was 10 if we all could be deconstructed and you knew your thoughts a chain reaction could be predicted. Everything minorly effects everything, it is logical. An all knowing being with a plan would know of everything to happen.
If god was imperfect an not all knowing I think the theology would make a bit more sense.
>Why create a being to suffer just as a demonstration
As He has revealed in His word, the purpose for which He made this world is the praise of His glory. As such He has foreordained events to demonstrate His glorious attributes through them, including His wrath upon the wicked, and His mercy upon the repentant. Correct me if I'm mistaken, but I'm guessing you have not read the bible yet?
>the purpose for which He made this world is the praise of His glory
People unironically worship this lol.
>I'm trying to understand under what faiths a god could exist because so far the Christian theology doesn't make sense to me with my determinist world view. I would like to think god does exist.
Wanting to think that something exists doesn't make that thing exist. I might want $1 trillion to exist in my bank account. But this wish alone won't make it so.
If I could choose I would rather not be an atheist as there hasn't been much of a time without a religious framework I think it may be helpful to have faith. But if I am to have faith I don't want it to be made on foundations which I have issues with.
I don't mean to 'religion shop' but I'm not going to identify with something I have issues in believing.
I haven't read the Bible I am not against reading of it, but for the time being I would like to find a religious text which foundations more align with my understanding.
I have very basic knowledge of Christianity.
>His wrath upon the wicked
Did he not create the wicked with the knowledge of what they would do. No disrespect to you or your faith but wouldn't a perfect being have no need for the demonstration, or create a plan that doesn't require the creation of these wicked souls or those souls being in hell for eternity.
>I would like to find a religious text which foundations more align with my understanding.
Would you not rather still find a text which is the true word of God, and align your understanding to His?
>I have very basic knowledge of Christianity.
Your knowledge would be improved by the scriptures.
>wouldn't a perfect being have no need for the demonstration
He doesn't need it.
>create a plan that doesn't require the creation of these wicked souls or those souls being in hell for eternity
Not if He wanted to demonstrate His just wrath.
Not him, but why do you think that the first cause of everything is so emotional?
>Would you not rather still find a text which is the true word of God, and align your understanding to His?
I wouldn't worship a god if his works were illogical, I can't just align my understanding and it be changed I need to be shown the wrong in my logic otherwise I will always question. I'm not going to prioritise the reading of the text if there isn't better logic that holds a different religious text. It would be ideal if I could be refuted and hold the faith of my family, but that isn't logical it's biased and a belief of shoddy foundations.
>Your knowledge would be improved by the scriptures.
Quite right I can appreciate it for the literature it is and I can gain lessons from it but it won't give me faith if I have questions on the power of this god that seems to me to be acting in an imperfect way.
>Not if He wanted to demonstrate His just wrath.
Why would he 'want' to demonstrate, why have that desire? If he needed to demonstrate for the sake of the beings he created, why not create a better being without the casting of souls to hell? Why the demonstration at all and why does the demonstration require the suffering of souls for eternity? I would say it isn't the perfect plan.
Thanks for the reply.
>>why would an all knowing god create beings that he knows will sin and then send them to hell for eternity when the god knows this person will fail
He creates them to bring about His future plans which are consequences of their actions, including their punishment which is a demonstration if His righteous wrath. He sends them to hell because that is the penalty merited by their wrongdoing.
>>why would an all knowing being change his plan for your prayer or ritual, when the god already knew of your plan and the prayer
He wouldn't. The purpose of prayer is not to alter God's will like a magical incantation, but to humble ourselves and bring us nearer to God.
>He creates them to bring about His future plans which are consequences of their actions, including their punishment which is a demonstration if His righteous wrath. He sends them to hell because that is the penalty merited by their wrongdoing.
So it's like when a kid plays with superhero toys and has superman beat up doomsday and put him into the shoebox under the bed?
No.
What's the relevant difference? To me it sounds like your god is just a scaled up toddler playing with his toys.
That's funny, because to me you sound like a scales up toddler having a fit.
Having a fit over what? I don't think you God actually exists, I just think the concept sounds really undignified.
Determinism is just sexed up nihilism. You’ll grow out of it. How old are you?
>why would God create evolution?
If you're a disbeliever, you'll not be able to reason.
>>Why would god create evolution
Good question I really can't find a reason. In the Christian faith I would argue against, and at what point a hominids were then human and could sin. Why were they created as part of the animal kingdom? At one point are they not animals and in the image of God? Does human belong to specificethnic to be in the image of God?
>I think it makes sense if a God created this world and left us to it then it would make sense but if that's the case why worship? I don't want to just be beating down religions with having no alternative. I want to believe.
I'm speculating on logic not believing this scenario.
Calvinism
>Calvinism
why is God creating some to cast them in to hell, it acknowledges the predesterminist view, but not why as far as I can see, so why?