Come back to your native Gods brothers

What do you mean by LARPing specifically?
Are you claiming to know what other people believe in more than they tell about themselves?
Also what do you mean by Pagan?
Which kind, which era, is it completely constructed like Wicca, or do you mean the Hippie/Junkie New Age Pagans?
Is dancing around a Maypole Pagan?
Is an Easteregghunt and Hamfestival also Pagan?
Is Easterfire Pagan?
Is a Harvest Festival?
Is New Years Eve a Pagan Holiday?
What about Krampus?
What about Carnival?
What about Halloween?
What about 'Winter-' and 'Sommersonnenwende'?

I am citing these because almost all people in this country (Austria) participate in these, yet none of them are particularly religious, and most of them think they're Pagan Holidays that (some) were adopted into Christianity.

There is also within the Germanosphere the divide between the Weihnachtsmann (Santa) and the Christkindl (Baby Jesus).
Is one Pagan and because the other is Christian?

I think Americans are Spiritually Neutered hence they don't even know what 'Paganism' even is, and just assume it's that Junkie in that Trailerpark who has 'Healing Crystals' and goes to Burning Man...

Sha’ul was not particularly original.

[...]
Also the fact that people celebrate holidays that have pagan origins is not something to be proud of. These are holidays which formerly had religious significance which have since been stripped of it completely. It's very similar to Christmas for most people (At least in the West) where the actual origin of the holiday is no longer entirely relevant and it has been largely secularized. Except in the case of many of these holidays they were Christianized, then secularized. Very few if any people are thinking about pagan gods when they celebrate these holidays or engage in traditions like Krampus. They have been in every sense deracinated from their pagan origins.

I understand what you are saying, however my experience here is more that Christians railed against these throughout History and tried to eradicate them.
In some places Maypoles and Christmastrees were outlawed, in other even a general 'pagan dancing' whatever that means...

The 'Status Quo' here were those Festivals and Traditions, and Christianity tried and failed to interfere.
In fact the Fairy & Folktales gathered by the Brothers Grimm I've heard are speculated to be altered forms of Pagan Myths, which they concealed in new Tales so they could evade Christian Persecution and pass on Moral Lessons to their Children.

So if in the rest of the West there is no Connection to these Roots, I understand your concerns.
But to label it as a General LARP is ridiculous.

I'm not talking about Wicca. I'm talking about people who pretend to believe in deities like Odin or Jupiter, actual historical pagan deities. No one currently living lived in, or knows someone who lived in the societies which created these religions, and originally practiced them. As I stated earlier these religions have been dead for the past few centuries. Thus, anyone who claims to "be a pagan" is engaging in a larp where they pretend to be apart of these traditions. This is all typical of the age though, people will of course adopt foreign, or dead and rootless religions in order to rebel against what they perceive as the status quo, in this case Christianity. We saw a similar thing in the 60s when Western youth were obsessed with "the East" in order to rebel against Western Christian society. It's completely contrived and consciously generated out of rebellion. It is LARP.

Also the fact that people celebrate holidays that have pagan origins is not something to be proud of. These are holidays which formerly had religious significance which have since been stripped of it completely. It's very similar to Christmas for most people (At least in the West) where the actual origin of the holiday is no longer entirely relevant and it has been largely secularized. Except in the case of many of these holidays they were Christianized, then secularized. Very few if any people are thinking about pagan gods when they celebrate these holidays or engage in traditions like Krampus. They have been in every sense deracinated from their pagan origins.

The only thing neopagans wipe is cum out of their asses, have you seen the number of gays into it?

>

>People this admit that they worship their religion because their ancestors did and not because of anything of merit.
Doesn't look like that to me. Seems like they're just saying that they have "absolutely no present connection to the pagan world as it was utterly vanquished 1000 years ago". Your conclusion is a big stretch, and you didn't even answer his question. Why should he care?

>People this admit that they worship their religion because their ancestors did and not because of anything of merit.
Doesn't look like that to me. Seems like they're just saying that they have "absolutely no present connection to the pagan world as it was utterly vanquished 1000 years ago". Your conclusion is a big stretch, and you didn't even answer his question. Why should he care?

He's admitting that he's worshiping religion based on inertia.

No different than any Muslims or israelites.

I don't worship israelites, I'm merely pointing out the fact that paganism is a contrived larp.

Nobody "worships Christianity" moron.

But it's funny the projection you're showing. You (and 99% of all atheists) only believe their (self-refuting) materialistic beliefs with its evolutionism fairy tale creation story because it's the state religion indoctrinated into kids in the LGBT government school system and reinforced in the israeli media.

Animism is paganism..

I don't see any difference, and besides we're talking about pagans in general not Romans in particular.

>we're talking about european paganism and christianity, how do you think christianity got so big?
By syncretism with paganism, which is why I'm so confused by why Christianity is supposed to be bad if syncretism is ok.

The US is literally one of the most pozzed countries on the planet right now.

Refers to a male homosexual fetish of unprotected anal sex, and giving AIDS to another gay man, as an analogy for woke politics entering mainstream political discourse.

>There are no good Christian Games to throw back at them
skyrim is literally about catholicism

Shit, I just noticed that qualifier there. I was moreso responding to the weird meme I see sometimes that pagans converted because of skyrim when skyrim has extremely christian overtones.

Plato and Aristotle =/= paganism. Read The Ancient City by Fustel de Coulanges and you'll see what I mean. Basically, what mattered to all Indo-European pagan cultures that we know of was performing the rituals correctly to a T. If the rituals are forgotten then it's over for you.

I define paganism as the religion of ancient Indo-European cultures. The Greek philosophers were free thinkers who didn't share the beliefs of their society -- Socrates was killed for causing people to question their beliefs. How would you define paganism?

Sounds like some sort of philosophy, and not actual paganism. It's quite impossible to be a real pagan in the modern age. You have to be the sort of person who believes that there are literal spirits everywhere, and that the reason why a knife is sharp is because it has the Spirit of Sharpness, and if it's blunt it's because it does not have the Spirit of Sharpness. At most, you can call yourself a neo-pagan, or "pagan" with scare quotes for good measure.

"I don't believe in the fundamental beliefs of Christianity, but I like the Christian aesthetic. I am a Christian."
There's a perfectly good word for people in your situation: neo-pagan.

How was it discovered to begin with? That's how.

The pagans had passed down that knowledge from generation to generation since time immemorial. If there's any way it was originally "discovered" it was probably through trial and error (seeing which rituals yield better results), or perhaps by having it revealed in a dream. Are you really going to try millions of different variations of rituals to see which make the gods the happiest? Are you going to wait for the truth to be revealed to you in a dream? Notice, philosophy is not part of it. You need to rely on the gods and not on yourself. That's why the public officials of the Roman republic, though they were nominally elected by the people, were in fact appointed by augurs after looking for signs from the gods.

As opposed to pagan. There are actually some real pagans in the world today, but they all live in isolated tribes.

> "I don't believe in the fundamental beliefs of Christianity, but I like the Christian aesthetic. I am a Christian."
That’s basically the future of Christianity also.

Those people won't be Christians then.

WODEN forgive me for uttering these words but... poland is.... based?

You know I have a link in my post showing the extent of the decline. Poland is going down the same route as Ireland and Quebec.

based Catholics, always winning.

indeed

>And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was given unto him: and he went forth conquering, and to conquer.
>Both thy bondmen, and thy bondmaids, which thou shalt have, shall be of the heathen that are round about you; of them shall ye buy bondmen and bondmaids.
>The one who conquers, I will grant him to sit with me on my throne, as I also conquered and sat down with my Father on his throne.
>The Lord shall cause thine enemies that rise up against thee to be smitten before thy face: they shall come out against thee one way, and flee before thee seven ways.
>indeed I will greatly bless you, and I will greatly multiply your seed as the stars of the heavens and as the sand which is on the seashore; and your seed shall possess the gate of their enemies.
>For David himself said by the Holy Ghost, The LORD said to my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool.
>For I say unto you, That unto every one which hath shall be given; and from him that hath not, even that he hath shall be taken away from him. But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.
>Your hand shall be on the neck of your enemies; Your father’s sons shall bow down to you.
>No weapon that is fashioned against you shall succeed, and you shall refute every tongue that rises against you in judgment.
>Behold, I have given you authority to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy, and nothing shall hurt you.
>“But if you carefully obey his voice and do all that I say, then I will be an enemy to your enemies and an adversary to your adversaries.
>“When you go out to war against your enemies, and see horses and chariots and an army larger than your own, you shall not be afraid of them, for the Lord your God is with you, who brought you up out of the land of Egypt.

>the world looks exactly the same as it did before him
............wut?

i'm definitely struggling to understand your statement.

I said literally nothing theological I was purely discussing history and you started showing you don’t give a shit about it

>I'll ignore all the Bible except the part that proves my point

absolutely am

>think

Funny how they are all like this now. Because reddit atheists spent so much time bashing on low hanging fruit like evangelicals, the 2020's e-trad now trawls the internet with a shit eating smug grin on his face, thinking to himself "I bet you've never heard of THOMAS AQUINAS before". They now hide behind a veneer of intellectual depth that really isn't that impressive upon closer inspection.

that your 'gods' are either powerless demons, or non-existent. most often non-existent. i'm laughing at the idea that someone actually believes they exist as powerful dieties when they conveniently have never exercised their power even once in all of human history.
at least be like most neopagans and say it's all a metaphor.

read the Bible and the lives of the Saints. you'll find plenty of miracles.

LMAO

We can consider your argument a partially modified version of the chart, where you expect us to believe church propaganda like "miracles" by saints and appeals to authority.

You are an atheist and you don't even believe in your own god, he is nothing more than a vague 'first cause' for your worldview.

>ummm he's the son of a god but he's not a DEMIGOD ok he's both FULLY human AND FULLY divine ok!

>heh.... it's not a contradiction, you just got FILTERED!

So it's all just conclusory beliefs based on presumptions that must be taken as a matter of faith. That's such a precarious place to be attacking somebody from, and yet you do it with so much pride. You have to realize that you just look like a tool, right?

I believe that I've met Odin before in passing, but I'm sure you're going to dismiss that out of hand, so I have to ask again: do you actually have any point to make here? Your argument thus far has essentially been "I'm right because I'm right," which I think it goes without saying is probably the least persuasive form of argumentation imaginable.

>what acts of divine power did the creator of mankind and the universe perform????
Your fedora is on too tight.

>ummm your god isn't real lol prove it
>mine is real because Saint Biddledieboo TOTALLY prayed to a picture of the venerably MARY and it started DRIPPING with what must have been HOLY WATER in the year of our lord 1832!

>it seems strange that you can't provide even a single example of a miracle.
neither can you moron

a legal procedure and some guy allegedly turning invisible.
wow, so powerful! LOL

my God flooded the entire Earth. he wiped out Sodom and Gomorrah. he fed thousands with a single loaf, he raised the dead, healed the sick, gave sight to the blind. he raised himself up from the grave and ascended into Heaven.
your 'god' performed a parlour trick

His Gods have done some sick stuff though. From creating the world by shaping it from a dead giant's corpse, to killing monsters in general, to fighting the Vanir and so on.

a legal procedure and some guy allegedly turning invisible.
wow, so powerful! LOL

>gets upset at big cosmological miracles
>gets upset at small personal miracles
Sounds like you're just gay. Have you considered taking the banana out of your butt? I know it's a big part of your atheism, but it's the current year dude.

>as i said, very shy, these beings if infinite power.
nobody said the gods have infinite power stupid abrahamic

>in what way did he display his omniscience?
I was deeply disturbed by something that had happened in my life, so I meditated on the Havamal one evening. The next day, I was able to put some of the teachings of the Havamal into practice (particularly Odin encouraging charity to the poor). I gave an old homeless man a bunch of money, and when I turned around and began walking up the street, I saw that an old man with a long, gray beard was watching me on the steps of a church. He smiled knowingly and waved, and I gave my best autistic "Y-you too" and left.

Well, given the circumstances under which I met him, something approaching omniscience.

Modern revivals of pagan religions are pathetic attempts at recreating something that really wasn't there

I agree, your whole Ortholarp thing is pretty pathetic.

>well if i redefine putting things up my butt to be good then odin is the bad guy for telling me not to put things up my butt!
Well, duh?

You're the one saying that you can redefine morality on the fly as you please here dude, not us. We believe that morality is objective and defined by the Gods, you believe that you can just come up with whatever you want. You can't, though, and it results in incoherence and anarchy.

The Havamal just reads like a pagan proverbs/wisdom of solomon.

I would presume it's because all of the stuff in it comes from Odin. Loddfafnir is just quoting Odin after all (leading to a humorous recursivity if we assume that Odin taught the Loddfafnismal to someone else).

>Havamal reads as being extremely morally advanced
now go see the other myths outside the havamal
also, nothing in the havamal strikes as particular moral advanced, or even moral(as in adressing morality/moral questions) at all

I did read it, that how I formed my opinion
you should read the rest of the eddas

[...]
>or even moral(as in adressing morality/moral questions)
yeah no you didnt read the fricking havamal at all lmfao odin directly addresses this repeatedly

No, I read it
much of that are just pratical stuff that would be seen as wisdom to a society structured like the old norse one and much more violent than today
I not saying that there isn't useful stuff there, only that it isn't advanced moral philosophy

>only that it isn't advanced moral philosophy
lets see, havamal has
>the golden rule, reciprocity
>all human life has value
>the worth a human life is not tethered to their wealth
>be generous and give to the needy
>do not prejudge others based on their status in life or on their appearance
>don't lie
>don't hold grudges or covet the possessions of another
>don't cheat on your spouse
And that's just off the top of my head. That seems like some pretty sophisticated moral thinking from Odin to me.

>now go see the other myths outside the havamal
You're going to have to list of some of the poems where the norse gods act morally dubious because, to wit, I think the poem where one of the gods is most morally dubious is probably Harbarhtsljoth where Odin says a bunch of terrible stuff to Thor (Most of it is outright lies but certain things, like Odin giving an opinion an something obviously can't be verified) to rile him up.
Otherwise, the gods are constantly out doing good stuff. Thor kills monsters that threaten humanity (he's explicitly called our protector in Voluspa), the gods appear to cure diseases and other afflictions according to pagan charms that we've uncovered, and Odin, evidenced by Havamal, likes to share his expansive knowledge with us humans for our own benefit.

Oh, get off it. Norse pagans still argue about stanza 83 to this day. Regardless of your internet misogyny echo chamber, this is indeed a hotly debated topic.

Oh my... I never should have insulted Woden...