Quranist Interpretations

Who is Muhammad according to Quranists, how exactly was he given the revelation and how did he disseminate it? If one rejects all hadith then that includes the Gabriel in the cave story of too. How was the Quran compiled according to them? I know there are varying viewpoints.

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  1. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    No idea about the Quranists, but I imagine it goes something like God just brought forth lightning from the sky and it engraved the Quran on some leather parchment

  2. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    quranists are a meme and probably a glow op

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      Other way around.
      Most early Muslims were Quranists anyways.

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        >Most early Muslims were Quranists anyways.
        What? They followed the sunnah from him IRL, as opposed to hand me downs. In fact they were more opposite the Quranists than modern Muslims, which cherry pick Hadiths to follow.

        • 9 months ago
          Anonymous

          The hadiths were written down much later, you moron.

          Any Quanist apologetics either defending or condeming some of Islam's controversies such as Muhhamed being bethroth to a six year old toddler (pedophillia = not cute and not funny) and marrying a cute and funny girl when she was nine years old (hebephillia = cute and funny)?

          Barely anything was known about Muhammad, and honestly, he most likely didn't exist. The same applies to Jesus.

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            >The hadiths were written down much later, you moron.
            So? What are you blabbering about?

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            it is precisely hearsay and nothing more written down centuries after the Muhammad died. You’d have to be a total moron to believe a syllable of it.
            >Bukhari, in compiling his work, said he had collected 600,000 traditions, and yet he included only 7,275 altogether in his Sahih
            what was kept is so absurd and contradictory and unbelievable, imagine the shit they didn’t include

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            That has nothing to do with the reply or the discussion at hand, that I was replying to, you blabbering mongoloid.

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            >I have no rebuttal
            lol frick you coward

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            Holy frick I'm talking to a literal moron.

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            why can’t you address what was said to you
            >I was talking to a different anon about something different!!!
            tough shit, now I’m talking to you

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            >Barely anything was known about Muhammad, and honestly, he most likely didn't exist. The same applies to Jesus.
            Moron.

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            please post first-hand sources about him written in the 7th century, preferably not non-muslim ones

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            >preferably not non-muslim ones
            ...so muslim ones?

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            …yes, are you autistic? there are several non-muslim firsthand sources on the arab conquests. I’m asking you about contemporary arab “muslim” sources on the man

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            Earliest evidence of Muhammad is the Arabs changing their calender to begin from when Muhammad returned to Mecca.

            Ashtiname of Muhammad is also authentic

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            nope

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            >1) It is supposedly dated to 625 AD, yet the Traditions say no letters were sent until 628 AD, and only to Medina.

            >2) There are 47 writings listed by Ibn Sa’d (845 AD), but the Ashtiname isn’t mentioned.

            >3) A Minaret is pictured, which were created in the 9th c., but not used until the 11th c.

            >4) The word 'Sultan' is referred to, but wasn’t used until Mahmud of Ghazna (998–1030 AD), 350 years later.

            >5) Mosques are mentioned, yet these were not in Egypt until 641 AD, & the Jizyah rates weren’t decided by Christians.

            >6) The term ‘Malak Muqarrah’ (Angel of Proximity), used here is not known until the 1st Sufi writings of Mutannabi, who lived in 965 AD, 340 yrs. later.

            >7) It is written in Christian, Egyptian, and Medieval Arabic, though these were not used by any Arabs in the Hejaz.

            >8) Dhimmi Laws are referred to, yet they weren't initiated until centuries later (i.e. repairing Churches, and forced marriages).

            >Conclusion: In short, the monks at St. Catherine's Monastery in the 16th c. needed protection from the marauding Muslims all around them, so they forged this letter, and then added Muhammad's name, and his hand, to give it authority in order to safeguard their Monastery.

            >Thus, it’s an 800-900 year-old fraud
            ?????

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            >it's a pajeet thread
            no wonder

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            Lmao I typed “stupid arab meme” into google, now address the contents of the post about the fake covenant of muhammad

            you literally ignored it moron
            [...]

            I ignored it cause it isn’t a Muslim source you dumb sandBlack person I specifically asked for Muslim sources from the 7th century you stupid pissdrinker

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            >non muslim source matches muslim source
            not surprised at your chimpout

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            you haven’t posted any Muslim sources despite being asked several times

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            >>At that time a certain man from along those same sons of Ismael, whose name was Mahmet [i.e., Mụhammad], a merchant, as if by God's command appeared to them as a preacher [and] the path of truth. He taught them to recognize the God of Abraham, especially because he was learnt and informed in the history of Moses. Now because the command was from on high, at a single order they all came together in unity of religion. Abandoning their vain cults, they turned to the living God who had appeared to their father Abraham. So, Mahmet legislated for them: not to eat carrion, not to drink wine, not to speak falsely, and not to engage in fornication. He said: 'With an oath God promised this land to Abraham and his seed after him for ever. And he brought about as he promised during that time while he loved Israel. But now you are the sons of Abraham and God is accomplishing his promise to Abraham and his seed for you. Love sincerely only the God of Abraham, and go and seize the land which God gave to your father Abraham. No one will be able to resist you in battle, because God is with you

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      >probably a glow op
      it has to be. It was never a thing before modern times

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        no. it’s certainly more to do with widespread literacy and in the west, growing exposure and thus interest.

        Other way around.
        Most early Muslims were Quranists anyways.

        This is true no matter how hard it makes abdul seethe

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        Quranists do not reject the hadiths altogether. They reject them as scripture from which rulings should be made. They usually accept many have worth as historical pieces.

        >
        Early Muslims were Quranists by necessity since there were no hadith collections for a while. Some were even consciously Quranists. The rashidun Omar forbade the drafting of hadiths and burned any copies of them lest people gave more attention to them than to the Quran.

        And of course those people from before Muhammad Muslims consider Muslims had no access to the hadiths as well.

        >Most early Muslims were Quranists anyways.
        What? They followed the sunnah from him IRL, as opposed to hand me downs. In fact they were more opposite the Quranists than modern Muslims, which cherry pick Hadiths to follow.

        They did not. Most people had at best only knowledge of a handful of hadiths. That is, what they had seen Muhammad do or say and what their friends told them he had said or done. Muslims that lived in groups that were not in direct contact with Muhammad essentially knew zero hadiths.

        • 9 months ago
          Anonymous

          >That is, what they had seen Muhammad do or say and what their friends told them he had said or done. Muslims that lived in groups that were not in direct contact with Muhammad essentially knew zero hadiths.
          Bro what? If a president does something then it spreads out accross the territory, and they imitate him thus fulfilling the sunnah. They didn't need the Hadith because he was still alive. They don't have to imitate him from old books...

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            Bro what? If a president does something then it spreads out accross the territory, and they imitate him thus fulfilling the sunnah.

            That did not happen. A major issue in collecting hadiths early on was that the knowledge of what Muhammad had said or done had spread very poorly initially. Much later on after the death of Muhammad the opposite happened and and it seemed everyone knew some hadiths, many contradictory, hence how hard establishing collections of hadiths and grading their reliability was.

        • 9 months ago
          Anonymous

          Can you enlighten me on Muslims before Muhammad

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            >the muslim enlightenment
            before muhammad, be terrorists and marry toddlers
            after muhammad, be terrorists and marry toddlers

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            I see this is one of the arguments made by quranists. as churchill said about islam:
            >No stronger retrograde force exists in the world
            is traditional islam is so great and the sunnah is the best thing ever and is the quran’s word of god in action then why is the muslim world such a dump?

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      Other way around.
      Most early Muslims were Quranists anyways.

      >probably a glow op
      it has to be. It was never a thing before modern times

      no. it’s certainly more to do with widespread literacy and in the west, growing exposure and thus interest. [...]
      This is true no matter how hard it makes abdul seethe

      >Most early Muslims were Quranists anyways.
      What? They followed the sunnah from him IRL, as opposed to hand me downs. In fact they were more opposite the Quranists than modern Muslims, which cherry pick Hadiths to follow.

      The early history of islam is a clusterfricky of epic proportions.

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        clusterfrickery*

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        Yes, but I was referring to demonstrable hadith skepticism in the first centuries after “early history of Islam”

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        >history
        >some literal who self-published hack
        They don't think it be like this but it do

        • 9 months ago
          Anonymous

          the single greatest cope and defense mechanism of them all. who the frick gives a shit if someone had a piece of paper from a cucked israelite college in the current year? there’s finite information. no one is working toward curing cancer here it’s not a field that develops and changes with new innovation. you’re just reading documents from thousands of years ago any idiot can do it if one dedicates himself. you are just appealing to authority, I guess like you do with your imams. also there is scholarly literature on this topic if you really want that but I’m sure you’ll find some surface level problem with it to b***h about. would you like a list of peer reviewed books published by well known universities I can provide that to you if you’d like?

        • 9 months ago
          Anonymous

          There's like 13 pages of bibliography but sure, your ad hominem has refuted his book. Congratulations. You have saved islam.

  3. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    Any Quanist apologetics either defending or condeming some of Islam's controversies such as Muhhamed being bethroth to a six year old toddler (pedophillia = not cute and not funny) and marrying a cute and funny girl when she was nine years old (hebephillia = cute and funny)?

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      Also I did not realize just how old Muhhamed when he married Aisha. That is not okay. At least the Virgin Mary about 12 years old when she was bethroth to Josepeh.

      >While the Bible does not specifically state how old Mary was when Jesus was born, most Christian historians speculate that she was around 15—16 years of age at the time of Jesus’ birth. According to israeli customs at the time, a young woman might become betrothed to a young man as early as 12 years of age, though the consummation of their marriage through ceremony and physical intimacy would not happen until they were legally married, many months or even years later.
      https://www.gotquestions.org/how-old-was-Mary.html

      For me, it is the Blessed Virgin Mary, the best cute and funny girl.

      • 9 months ago
        Ο Σολιταίρ

        The Protoevangelium of James is completely fiction.

        • 9 months ago
          Anonymous

          >some authority figures 1500 years ago said The Protoevangelium of James is completely fiction.
          ftfy

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      Also I did not realize just how old Muhhamed when he married Aisha. That is not okay. At least the Virgin Mary about 12 years old when she was bethroth to Josepeh.

      >While the Bible does not specifically state how old Mary was when Jesus was born, most Christian historians speculate that she was around 15—16 years of age at the time of Jesus’ birth. According to israeli customs at the time, a young woman might become betrothed to a young man as early as 12 years of age, though the consummation of their marriage through ceremony and physical intimacy would not happen until they were legally married, many months or even years later.
      https://www.gotquestions.org/how-old-was-Mary.html

      For me, it is the Blessed Virgin Mary, the best cute and funny girl.

      Aisha is not in the Quran. Muhammad himself is barely in the Quran, and some believe it is referring to a prestigious title for Jesus and not a proper name at all. The Muhammad of traditional Islam is semi-legendary at best, not unlike Lao Tzu or William Tell

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        Is it true that according to Quran Islam is not a religion, but rather an individual path of every human being to God and that all religions are just different paths

        • 9 months ago
          Anonymous

          Mostly bullshit.

  4. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    >When the candidatus [i.e., Sergios, commander of the Byzantine army in Palestine] was killed by the Saracens, I was at Caesarea and I set off by boat to Sykamina. People were saying "the candidatus has been killed," and we israelites were overjoyed. And they were saying that the prophet had appeared, coming with the Saracens, and that he was proclaiming the advent of the anointed one, the Christ who was to come. I, having arrived at Sykamina, stopped by a certain old man well-versed in scriptures, and I said to him: "What can you tell me about the prophet who has appeared with the Saracens?" He replied, groaning deeply: "He is false, for the prophets do not come armed with a sword. Truly they are works of anarchy being committed today and I fear that the first Christ to come, whom the Christians worship, was the one sent by God and we instead are preparing to receive the Antichrist. Indeed, Isaiah said that the israelites would retain a perverted and hardened heart until all the earth should be devastated. But you go, master Abraham, and find out about the prophet who has appeared." So I, Abraham, inquired and heard from those who had met him that there was no truth to be found in the so-called prophet, only the shedding of men's blood. He says also that he has the keys of paradise, which is incredible.
    Muslims be like
    >yeah that sounds like our prophet right here!

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      >he takes israeli and christian polemics as fact to stick it to the muslims
      lmao

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        Muslims themselves claim this text is evidence of the prophet.

        • 9 months ago
          Anonymous

          well yes. It's christians and israelites seething at Muhammad

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            Mostly bullshit.

            >he takes israeli and christian polemics as fact to stick it to the muslims
            lmao

            it’s time to stop posting. you just keep saying “nu-uh!!!” “nope!!” “you’re dumb!!”. if you’re not going to show the 7th century “muslim” sources for your alleged moon-splitting persian horse monstrosity-riding-into-the-sky prophet, just stop posting. it’s that simple.

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            >Get BTFO
            >start chimping out

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous
          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            I already have you literally ignored it

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            nope

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            you literally ignored it moron

            >>At that time a certain man from along those same sons of Ismael, whose name was Mahmet [i.e., Mụhammad], a merchant, as if by God's command appeared to them as a preacher [and] the path of truth. He taught them to recognize the God of Abraham, especially because he was learnt and informed in the history of Moses. Now because the command was from on high, at a single order they all came together in unity of religion. Abandoning their vain cults, they turned to the living God who had appeared to their father Abraham. So, Mahmet legislated for them: not to eat carrion, not to drink wine, not to speak falsely, and not to engage in fornication. He said: 'With an oath God promised this land to Abraham and his seed after him for ever. And he brought about as he promised during that time while he loved Israel. But now you are the sons of Abraham and God is accomplishing his promise to Abraham and his seed for you. Love sincerely only the God of Abraham, and go and seize the land which God gave to your father Abraham. No one will be able to resist you in battle, because God is with you

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            To be fair, he hasn't read the Quran so from his perspective you could just be making shit up and he'd have no way of knowing otherwise.

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            the Muhammad character we are discussing is barely in the Quran if at all. You probably read a version with all those interpolations in it. You know the stuff in brackets isn’t actually there right?

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            For those who deny the existence of Muhammad, what is the significance of surahs like Al-Masad which literally only exists to condemn someone Muhammad was seething at to hell? Obvious idiosyncracies and demonstrations of personality like this are what have me convinced Muhammad obviously existed and dictated the Quran. He's a lovable schizo.

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            if muhammad was real why did he marry a 6 year old?

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            It was not unusual in his culture or most others for most of history, I don't see why it's unrealistic.

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            >it wasn’t unusual
            >only one of his eleven wives was a child

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            Yes?

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            Because he was a pedo.

  5. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    Quranists dont know anything about Islam, nor about the Quran. Their rejection of hadith neither rigourous, nor grounded in logical principle. They follow their emotions

    So they have no idea who Muhammad is

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      Sunnis dont know anything about Islam, nor about the Quran. Their rejection of the Bible is neither rigourous, nor grounded in logical principle. They follow their emotions.

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