As a Christian, can I use Chaos Magic?

Is white magic forbidden to me as a Christian? There are Bible passages that say not to do divination or witchcraft, but what about harnessing chaos to improve my life? I don't see how it is the same thing, it is an energy source that is neutral, not demonic. IMO sigils are like weightlifting and supplements: i'm just using nature to make my life better I don't think God says that's a bad thing! I mean not demon sigils, but magical affirmations encoded visually and that sort of thing.

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  1. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    no

    • 8 months ago
      Anonymous

      Incorrect. You can do chaos magic, chaos magic doesn't care it's about finding magic that works. Your christian status (and whoever grants it) may care but the worst they can do is say you're a bad Christian. Christianity is a magus religion, it is expected to have mages in it.

      • 8 months ago
        Anonymous

        Leviticus 19:26
        "Ye shall not eat any thing with the blood neither shall ye use enchantment nor observe times" and christianity is not a magus religion

        • 8 months ago
          Anonymous

          Leviticus is old testament, plus, I have to add that isn't prayer a form of magic. albeit, the easiest form to practice?

          • 8 months ago
            Anonymous

            prayer and magic are different they aren't the same

          • 8 months ago
            Anonymous

            That's where you're wrong kiddo

          • 8 months ago
            Anonymous

            disprove it then

            Christianity certainly is a magus religion, you want to know the archype for christ?
            >He's the Trickster
            Lay hands, cast out demons, chant the names of god, be the son of god that is god himself. Is this not magic? is this not your birthright? It's a poor israeli one but Yours surely.

            >Even if god got mad
            Didn't jesus give everyone a pass? I mean if they let pedos into heaven surely they will let the magus in. Of course that homosexual paul is not going to go say be the whole authority onto yourself. Paul was a israeli subverter, do the opposite of what paul says. I mean you have to reconcile the only begotten son of god with us all being the children (aka sons and daughters) of god. The idea that there was a book back in the day on religion back 2000 years ago that didn't have magic in it rather pushes incredulity once you realize why spells are called spells.

            but you do you boo. There's no problem with Chaos Magic. I make it a point to be christian for about 5 mins a years
            >Just in case.
            See you heaven Christbros, Don't worry I'll be better company then the fricking pedos.

            christianity focuses on faith morality and the worship of god other then magic and there is a problem with chaos magic

          • 8 months ago
            Anonymous

            https://thavmapub.com/2017/06/30/when-youre-not-getting-results/

            Prayers is asking God to give you magical and physical energy to do something yourself, you can’t force the hand of God, that is God won’t change reality Himself just because you asked for it - instead God gives you the power for you to change reality. What about magic that works with spirits? Praying to God also involves various spirits because spirits are the make up of existence, by praying to God on a certain subject you are also influencing the spirits in that subject and moulding them in the power that praying gives you. You command spirits by thinking and such, and also simply by talking. That’s why intercession works, you aren’t praying for the Saint to pray for you, God knows what you are praying for, you are praying through the Saint and the specific area of reality they hold

        • 8 months ago
          Anonymous

          Christianity certainly is a magus religion, you want to know the archype for christ?
          >He's the Trickster
          Lay hands, cast out demons, chant the names of god, be the son of god that is god himself. Is this not magic? is this not your birthright? It's a poor israeli one but Yours surely.

          >Even if god got mad
          Didn't jesus give everyone a pass? I mean if they let pedos into heaven surely they will let the magus in. Of course that homosexual paul is not going to go say be the whole authority onto yourself. Paul was a israeli subverter, do the opposite of what paul says. I mean you have to reconcile the only begotten son of god with us all being the children (aka sons and daughters) of god. The idea that there was a book back in the day on religion back 2000 years ago that didn't have magic in it rather pushes incredulity once you realize why spells are called spells.

          but you do you boo. There's no problem with Chaos Magic. I make it a point to be christian for about 5 mins a years
          >Just in case.
          See you heaven Christbros, Don't worry I'll be better company then the fricking pedos.

  2. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    magic cannot give you more than god can give you

    you can only ask (via magic)
    but god can give you what you could never ask for, what you cannot even dream of...

    which do you prefer?

    • 8 months ago
      Anonymous

      Ok but hear me out... God established the rules of the Universe. One of the rules of the Universe is that information is magic. And God says that we have to invest in and expand our talents. But we can't use the natural laws of the Universe to grow our talents if the laws are magical instead of chemical or biological?

      • 8 months ago
        Anonymous

        fair point. but you need to be guided by god.
        what can you do without guidance?
        you will end up like everyone who came before
        they were lost wandering in eternity, and couldn't find their way out.
        the deeper they went, the more blinded they became
        then they convinced themselves they were god/gods
        then they stopped seeking guidance

        • 8 months ago
          Anonymous

          >but you need to be guided by god
          this is honestly the most important thing.

          https://i.imgur.com/2AY0FKM.jpg

          Is white magic forbidden to me as a Christian? There are Bible passages that say not to do divination or witchcraft, but what about harnessing chaos to improve my life? I don't see how it is the same thing, it is an energy source that is neutral, not demonic. IMO sigils are like weightlifting and supplements: i'm just using nature to make my life better I don't think God says that's a bad thing! I mean not demon sigils, but magical affirmations encoded visually and that sort of thing.

          that said, the Christian God is a god of order so i'd find a different school of magic.

    • 8 months ago
      Anonymous

      The Bible is clear, sorcery of any kind lead's to damnation.
      >Revelation 22:15
      >Outside are the dogs, those who practice magic arts, the sexually immoral, the murderers, the idolaters and everyone who loves and practices falsehood.

      >Ezekiel 13:20
      >Therefore this is what the Sovereign LORD says: I am against your magic charms with which you ensnare people like birds and I will tear them from your arms; I will set free the people that you ensnare like birds.
      There are dozens of instances in the Bible that vehemently push against the use of magic of all kinds.

      >magic cannot give you more than god can give you
      I couldn't have said it better. Christ has given already given his followers power over the circles of hell, over death itself, the power to heal the sick, raise the dead, drive out infections, prophesy through dreams and much more. The power is yours, the only limit is your faith.
      >Philippians 4:13
      >"I can do all things through Christ which strengthens me."

      that was literally how jesus did miracles

      >jesus did miracles through sorcery
      Wrong, it is clearly defined Jesus preformed miracles by the power of the father and Holy Spirit not by magic or sorcery of any kind.
      >Matthew 12:24/27-28
      >When the Pharisees heard this, they said, “This man can force demons out of people only with the help of Beelzebul, the ruler of demons.”

      > If I force demons out of people with the help of Beelzebul, who helps your followers force them out? That’s why they will be your judges. But if I force demons out with the help of God’s Spirit, then the kingdom of God has come to you.

      • 8 months ago
        Anonymous

        Do you really believe that translations are in anyway reliable
        >those who practice magic arts,
        Haha, the translator must realise that he is lying through his teeth pulling out that bullshit translation.

        What do you think magic is, how do you think magic works? Magic simply changing the world and our being via our consciousness, so the invoking the Holy Spirit within us is indeed magic, unless you want to define magic as ‘anything not Christian’ which is redundant or ‘anything not from God’ which is impossible. You do magic by simply thinking specific thoughts, and those thoughts change the world around you.

        How does any Christian do an exorcism? By saying prayers and do signs of the cross, which is funny because that’s the exact methodology that many grimoires use. Magic, theurgy, is the art of establishing God’s divinity as a divine language upon this earth.

        True magic is divine, true magic comes from the awareness that your faith empowers it, your faith in Christ is the true magic of the logos. As opposed to petty sorcery that only focuses on things happening because just doing the instructions makes them happen.

  3. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    GEE, LET ME THINK.

  4. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    that was literally how jesus did miracles

    • 8 months ago
      Anonymous

      I know! There are several times in the NT where it's obvious that simply because of the way Jesus said something, it came to be. Jesus was the master of assumption and of making postulates. So Jesus showed us that the way we structure what we say has power, but we are supposed to ignore this truth? I think instead, we must act like Him.

  5. 8 months ago
    Departing

    So? We have a Peter cross.

  6. 8 months ago
    Departing

    Did you please buy her a drink?

  7. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    Listen, if the skydaddy you're worshipping is holding grudges because you are trying to empower yourself (I check my motives when doing so), then you're worshipping the wrong skydaddy.

  8. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    NOT AS I WILL, BUT AS YOU WILL
    - Jesus

  9. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    https://archive.4plebs.org/x/thread/34923504/
    Didn't you post this before?

  10. 8 months ago
    Departing

    I told you Jon ferens-foulet

  11. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    christianity came from second temple judaism, judaism permits the use of magic (kabbalah), meaning at some point during christianity's evolution from its source, magic was atleast tolerated/permitted. The average person of the time, regardless of faith, practiced magic, we know this due to remnants of magical working found in trash heaps of the time. It was just a natural part of the life of le people at th time.
    https://www.researchgate.net/publication/364164950_MAGIC_VS_BELIEF_EARLY_CHRISTIANITY
    https://www.biblicalarchaeology.org/daily/ancient-cultures/ancient-near-eastern-world/christian-magic-and-miracles/
    It wasn't until the church and its scholars dedicated to writing the bible, for political and other reasons, wrote the laws against magic into the bible. Many such instances of this have occurred throughout its life, to an extent in which I personally believe the bible to no longer be the word of god, and instead corrupted beyond repair into a tool of control by the church.
    It is, in my opinion, invalid, and you should develop a relationship with god directly, independent of it and any other institution

    With THAT out of th way, chaos magic does not discriminate against religion, and can actually be, due to its nature, very easily adapted seamlessly to whatever standards its user has, so yes, you can use chaos magic. The only thing I assume god himself would disprove of is its use for evil purposes

    • 8 months ago
      Anonymous

      it can be compared to things like meditation, astral projection and reiki/similar energy working in how religiously benign it is, it's just a greater expression of your will than what is accomplishable by normal means

    • 8 months ago
      Anonymous

      no you can't use chaos magic if your christian maybe if your a israelite

      • 8 months ago
        Anonymous

        My point is that any rules against magic in christianity were instated by (Very most likely corrupt) humans rather than god, meaning they're invalid

        • 8 months ago
          Anonymous

          well there are verses

          • 8 months ago
            Anonymous

            The bible owes itself to the torah as much as christianity itself does to judaism

          • 8 months ago
            Anonymous

            Christianity didn't just spontaneously appear in a vacuum, in every way it first came from its predecessor, and its predecessor permitted the use of magic, anything that goes against this in the bible is a human modification

  12. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    Believe it or not, yes you can, but you need to be crafty. You need to use a sin totem. The sin totem is essentially a concentrated form of your sin that you can re-direct all of the passive corruption of Chaos magic to. If you use Chaos magic for evil the totem will NOT protect you. To make a sin totem you need to fast for around 12 hours, watch gay porn, jerk off, eat your semen, and then listen to the most unholy death metal you can while defecating out your gay porn induced semen. Next, take your excrement and craft it into a tiny doll. Take your real hair and put it on the doll. Use your real finger nails and put them on the doll. It doesn’t need to be perfect, but you can’t half ass it. It needs to somewhat resemble a human. Next you need to condemn the doll and declare “O totem of sin, may you ever go hungry!” You can now use Chaos magic freely. Be very careful with the sin totem as it accumulates corruption. There have been stories of them coming to life and murdering their creator. At some point you need to flush the totem HOWEVER!!!! Make sure you put a drop of holy water in the toilet or it will corrupt your plumbing and your house will become demonic.

  13. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    God gave you the power to do it, didn't He?

  14. 8 months ago
    Departing

    I am banishing Jon ferens-foulet into phyto plankton.

  15. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    Christzoomers really ask this shit.
    What part of
    >Revelation 21:8
    >Deuteronomy 18:10
    >Exodus 22:18
    >Acts 19:19
    >Exodus 8:18
    and so on do you not fricking understand? Read your own book, moron. I'm not even Christian and I know this.

    • 8 months ago
      Anonymous

      Lol, your failed attempts at gatekeeping amuses me. Don’t forget that it’s simply neat impossible to escape Christian influences in any modern day occult practices, and modern day occultists owe much of their stuff to Christian occultists.

      Don’t play dumb, I know your fricking game. I don’t doubt you know the true meanings of those passages, and their mistranslations, you little gatekeeping neo-pagan larper you

  16. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    >You’ll be fine anon
    >God loves you and me
    >Soon we’ll be in a big happy family

  17. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    Also anon if you want a bigger list of things you can practice as a christian; Cunning folk practices and what they brought over to america (use google), rosicrucianism, hermetecism, alchemy, and spagyrics, christian kabbalah and maybe catholic occultism/esoterica? I know they have some I just don't know what it's called

    • 8 months ago
      Anonymous

      you should also research psalm magic, also maybe The Magical Power of the Saints by Ray Marlbrough could be of interest to you ?

  18. 8 months ago
    Departing

    SLAM SLAM homie BACK THE FRICK UP (I'll be black one day)

  19. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    Converting to Christianity is an act of chaos magic. So is deconversion. Some Chaotes temporarily join a religion to perceive the experiential effects of switching reality-tunnels but that's a little cynical unless you pick a sect that's open to tourists.

  20. 8 months ago
    Departing

    Because the next door brown strings next door next door

  21. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    [...]

    get thee behind me satan.
    >verification not required

  22. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    [...]

    he's not since the antichrist is the antichrist

  23. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    [...]

    he's not since the antichrist is the antichrist

  24. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    This, the bible specifically forbade Christians from practicing magic, the whole point of the faith is that you only need to rely on God

    • 8 months ago
      Anonymous

      Meant to quote

      Christzoomers really ask this shit.
      What part of
      >Revelation 21:8
      >Deuteronomy 18:10
      >Exodus 22:18
      >Acts 19:19
      >Exodus 8:18
      and so on do you not fricking understand? Read your own book, moron. I'm not even Christian and I know this.

    • 8 months ago
      Anonymous

      No it forbade paganism and foreign practices (for the israelites), and it forbids sorcery (which is different to magic), but it’s translated as magic for obvious ideological reasons.

      Sacraments, Mass, prayers, exorcisms, baptism etc., that’s all magic, as clear as day

  25. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    [...]

    he's not since the antichrist is the antichrist

  26. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    if your'e alive
    you literally do it without being aware

    soooo stay literally woke?!

  27. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    this is now the 2nd use of the word "free" for this thread

  28. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    [...]

    Oh God, none Christians talking about Christianity in the sense of
    >urrr, I am pretty sure Christians can’t do X. Why are you doing X if you are a Christian bro? No Christian does X

    Pisses me off, mind your own business

    • 8 months ago
      Anonymous

      Read the fricking bible you dumb shit, Revelations is very clear on magic. Hell, ask a priest. Oh wait, you can't because you've never even set foot in a church.

      • 8 months ago
        Anonymous

        I have read the Bible, I don’t live under a fricking rock, I know what normies think of Christianity and magic and I know they are wrong. I simply know more than you, also you aren’t a Christian, so your opinion is wrong.

        Esoteric Christianity and Christian magic has been a tradition that has existed since the beginning of Christianity (look at the book ancient Christian magic), and has existed throughout the Middle Ages, Renaissance (Renaissance magic) and early modern period - Golden Dawn. In fact the hyper religious Amish practice folk magic, and you should really look into stuff like the Pow Wow practices too. You’re a normalgay, you don’t know shit about anything.

        • 8 months ago
          Anonymous

          Lol, your failed attempts at gatekeeping amuses me. Don’t forget that it’s simply neat impossible to escape Christian influences in any modern day occult practices, and modern day occultists owe much of their stuff to Christian occultists.

          Don’t play dumb, I know your fricking game. I don’t doubt you know the true meanings of those passages, and their mistranslations, you little gatekeeping neo-pagan larper you

          Walk into a fricking church and ask a priest. Any church with more than 50 members, your choice. Post results.
          >inb4 you can't because you don't even know where your local church is
          Magic is an affront to God, full stop. Even the gnostic gospels confirm this. You are to rely on the power of God alone, and it is all you need.

          • 8 months ago
            Anonymous

            Magic is very much relying on the power of God, you have no idea what you talk about or really what existence is, because if you did your superstitions regarding magic would end
            > Walk into a fricking church and ask a priest. Any church with more than 50 members, your choice.
            I honestly don’t care what they think, as much respect as I have for them and their work (the good ones)
            > Even the gnostic gospels confirm this
            One of the big reasons why modern Christianity so hard on its anti-magic stance, is that early Christians very much practiced magic, and magic was frowned upon in pagan rome. many Gnostic sects practiced magic officially, as part of the integral part of the faith, you can see in polemics of pagans talking about how Christian elders that have talked to were practicing magic and how they kept books on magic. Because of this people accused Jesus of simply being a sorcerer, so big Christian names had to dedicate a lot to removing this association

          • 8 months ago
            Anonymous

            moron, read the bible. Better yet, read the gnostic gospels.
            >angels taught humans magic while fricking them
            >god gets fricking pissed because they're not supposed to know any of that
            >demands the magic users be killed
            God is not okay with humans having magic. If humans were meant to wield magic the Bible would be a spellbook. It is not.

          • 8 months ago
            Anonymous

            Wait a fricking second, you literally don't even know what I mean by gnostic gospels, do you? Holy fricking shit you're not even a Christian, guaranteed. Frick off fed.

          • 8 months ago
            Anonymous

            moron, read the bible. Better yet, read the gnostic gospels.
            >angels taught humans magic while fricking them
            >god gets fricking pissed because they're not supposed to know any of that
            >demands the magic users be killed
            God is not okay with humans having magic. If humans were meant to wield magic the Bible would be a spellbook. It is not.

            You mean Enoch? So you believe that astronomy is also evil?
            > magic the Bible would be a spellbook
            I mean it holds and describes the essence of magic

  29. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    Chaos magick isn’t the tradition you want to look into, instead look into the Golden Dawn/Martinist/Elus Coen tradition of magic, also the works of Dion fortune and Gareth Knight. You can use some technics from chaos magick, like sigils, but use them in s different way to how chaos magicians use them.

    Read all of this http://www.labirintoermetico.com/06Numerologia_Cabala/Arbatel_Of_Magick.pdf , should be your basic introduction to magick and then the mystical qabbalah by Dion fortune

  30. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    When hope is lost. A leap of faith is necessary.

  31. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    However bare no mistake. Chaos IS evil. At the end of revelations it says that the enemy is the Devil and Death. Wherein Death is actually the final boss. Chaos is evil because it necessitates change. Change is evil because it necessitates what once was to cease to be. It needs Death. Hence. Eternal order constitutes the essence of perfection when coupled with eternal life. This is the Mandate of Heaven.

  32. 8 months ago
    Anonymous

    Just pray, buttmunch

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